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Pro-120 series controllers.
Fault finding

Introduction

Common faults on the Pro-120 series are - not common. So a full fault finding chart is not a practical proposition. But there are a few faults which occur, mainly because the 'bare board' style of the controller makes it susceptible to certain abuses.

The intention was to update this page slowly as users show the need for assistance. The fact is that the controllers are generally so well behaved that relevant problems are rare!

You may find it helpful to identify the issue number of the controller.


Faults Index


Battery condition flashes when ignition switched on, but then goes out

This is a normal symptom of the High Pedal Lockout operating properly because of an external fault. So it usually indicates a mechanical fault causing the throttle pot not to return to zero.

See Ignition relay won't stay pulled in

Bad pot earthing.

This sort of fault is only likely to happen on model locos, especially where double heading.

Theoretically, if the wiring was bad such that the pot reference (pin F of the 6 way connector) was connected to chassis, an earth current could flow through pin F. This will probably blow the fuse track to this pin. If this fault happened, the pot would still find its reference through the faulty earth - but the current in this earth is putting a voltage on the bottom of the pot (which is what caused the fuse track to blow). Under these circumstances, the High Pedal Lockout could quite possibly detect this spurious earth signal as the pot not being zeroed.

See Ignition relay won't stay pulled in


Blown MOSFETs


When MOSFETs fail, they can usually be seen to be visibly damaged. A service page is available for the NCC series explaining what else may fail and how to test. Pro-120 circuitry is essentially the same as the NCC.

Be warned that replacing blown MOSFETs in a Pro-120 is not an easy task and requires skill! It is easy to damage the board, by removing the through hole plating and by stripping top-side gate tracks.


Controller is dead or ignition relay won't hold on

Smell the controller: failed controllers usually have a noticeable burnt smell where MOSFETs have blown. Otherwise problem is usually a dud pot or pot wiring, or the HPLO is detecting a fault and operating!

  1. Read Pro-120, Scoota and NCC series controllers internal power supply and protection circuitry.
  2. Is the ignition switch fitted and working?
  3. With the ignition switch off, check there is full battery voltage (measured with meter negative on controller's B- terminal) on the yellow wire to the ignition switch - connector pin A.
  4. Check the voltage between pins D and F on the 6 way connector: Exact voltage is unimportant, but it should be steady and not vary much (10% maybe) as the pot is turned.
    See Pro-120 series controllers - Key components for identification. The zener is item 1 and the relay driver is item 24 (Tr 8)
  5. Is there anything other than a pot (minimum value 5K) drawing current from the 9v rail? The controller does not have spare power for outside devices and if these cause the 9v rail to fall, the ignition relay will disengage.
  6. Is the High pedal lockout engaging? Its operation is to immediately de-activate the ignition relay if the controller is turned on with the pot not at zero or faulty or wiring is faulty.
  7. Is the parking brake faulty? Unplug it and manually disengage the brake.

See also Ignition relay won't stay pulled in

Connections overheat

We use and recommend these crimp connectors because they are reliable. The F-type crimps we supply require a special (expensive) tool and it is nearly impossible to operate this so as to make a bad crimp. However the commonly-available, yellow-insulated crimps are of variable manufacture and many different tools are available, most of which can give a bad crimp.

Solder is a high resistance material and is must be used very carefully if it is carrying high current. Not suitable for connections of this type.

Screw connections are subject to variable tightening and mechanical irregularity. Bolting to a circuit board is therefore problematical.

A properly crimped connection is 'gas-tight' - the strands of wires are deformed and squeezed into hexagonal cross section. All the air between the strands is excluded and the metal of the stands forms a pressure weld, making an extremely good and reliable joint.

Bad Crimps

Properly crimped connections are very reliable and the push-on connections are very good if properly made so overheating here always indicates the connections are bad.

Badly made crimps let air at the strands of the wires, which oxidise over time and the joint resistance increases. As they degrade, they start to get hot - which accelerates the degradation. In extremes, this heat can be transferred to the circuit board terminal and we have seen about two cases where the circuit board was actually burned as a result.

Mechanically stressed connections

Every time a push-on connector is removed and re-made, the springiness of the connector relaxes a little. So is a connector is removed too many times, the contact resistance increases and this can cause heating.

The effect is heavily exacerbated if there is any sideways pressure on the connector: maybe the wire is too short and is pulling continuously at the connector.


Controller will only go in one direction.


As you advance the controller from zero speed, one relay should click in forward direction and the other relay should click if reverse is selected.

Note: the controller may not reverse properly if there is no motor connected (i.e. the output is open circuit): it requires some sort of load (resistor or motor) or the highside current limit engages and prevents correct operation.

Controller fails to react to reverse switch and goes forward regardless

This indicates the trouble is in the switch of wiring, and not in the controller. The reversing signal is not getting to the controller.

Check the voltage on pin C of the 6 way connector (black wire) - it should change from zero (forward) to full battery (reverse). It it's not doing this then the switch of wiring is faulty.

Controller fails to react to reverse switch and goes in reverse regardless

There is a signal on the reverse line which the reverse switch is not removing.

Measure the voltage on pin C of the 6 way connector (black wire). When forward is selected this should be zero volts. If not zero, than a voltage above approximately 6.5v will engage reverse.

Relays click properly

Usually this means the controller is working but the gain is set too low. On a standard controller, reverse is at half of forward speed. If the gain is set low, forward speed is low and half of this low forward speed may not be enough tom get the motor moving.

Another theoretical possibility is that there the relay contacts are dirty. However these relays used do have high contact pressure and tend to be self cleaning as a bad contact will, initially, get hot - which clears the problem before it shows up.

One relay clicks, other does not

A relay could be stuck in the de-energised state. Or it could be stuck in the energised state.

Energised
If one relay is permanently energised, there will be no relay click as the speed is advanced from zero in that direction but the motor will operate. There will be a relay click in the other direction, but no motor operation.
De-energised
If one relay is permanently de-energised, there will be a relay click in that direction, but no motor operation. In the other direction there will be no clock but the motor will operate.

Same relay clicks, both directions

This would imply that there is a fault in the reversing switch or the reversing logic on the board.


Half speed reverse will not disengage


Sorry about this - you've spotted a manufacturing defect. We don't make many, but we are only human! The half speed reverse must disengage if the link is properly broken. It follows that removing the header is not breaking the link. So look for a solder bridge across the appropriate pins.

Controller switches itself off as soon as throttle is engaged

With issue 9 (see Issue number history) the parking brake driver is protected against faults in the parking brake wiring.

This protection will cause the controller to switch itself off as soon as the parking brake is released (as the throttle is engaged) if there is a fault.

So unplug the parking brake, disengage it mechanically and, if the machine now functions, the parking brake or its wiring is faulty and the controller is simply reacting to this.


Controller will operate with wheels off the ground but gives no power

Controllers never fade away. When they die, they go usually with a bang and fail completely. Lack of power is always a battery or wiring problem! You need to measure the battery to properly see what is happening. A batter condition meter, if fitted, measures the battery - but is switched on and off by the Pro-120's power relay so only what it measures before this happens is useful.

The Pro-120 does not have battery discharge protection: this can however be engaged, see the instruction manual. However if the battery voltage falls too low, the Pro-120 will turn power down to avoid the relays disengaging. So with a normal dead or discharged battery the voltage should fall to about 15v but no lower and the controller's relays should not disengage.

Not all batteries fail gracefully, Sometimes a battery fails (usually a single cell) such that, above a certain current, the battery voltage suddenly falls very low - in effect the cell suddenly switches open-circuit. This is too sudden for the Pro-s undervoltage to work and the power relay will disengage.

Either of these effects could also be caused by bad connections or wiring to the batteries.


Overheating

If all the wiring is good and the controller is pushed to the limit, it will overheat. Although there is an overheat sensor fitted, there is actually no single point that gets predictably hottest first, so measuring only one 'hot-spot- is not perfect, but it would not be possible to monitor all possible points that can get hot.

It is quite possible for the controller to get so hot that the solder melts. This can happen well before any electrical failure, but once the solder melts it will run and cause a problem.

If the controller is overheating, it indicates that it is in fact working properly and that the system is simply asking too much of the controller.

Legitimate overheating may show up in several ways:


Ignition relay won't stay pulled in


See above under 'Controller is dead'.

As explained in Pro, Scoota and NCC series controllers internal power supply and protection circuitry, the 9v rail's presence is used to power up the ignition relay.

The ignition relay will fail to power up properly under the following fault conditions:


Relays drop out

If the battery voltage falls low enough, any relay will drop out. The Pro-120 series have under-voltage cutback which prevents this. As supplied, the level on the 24v controllers is around 15 volts, enough that the relays will hold. However - cutback is disabled on the 12v controllers.

However - if the voltage dip is causes by something other than the controller, then there is nothing the controller can do to prevent the dip and, if it dips too low, the relays will indeed drop out.

Even if the controller catches itself - such a dip does mean that the batteries and/or wiring are inadequate to give the current required. There's nothing the controller can do about that!


System lacks power

This probably is not a controller fault. Controllers either work properly - or they fail. For a controller to partially fail is almost unknown.

If you push a Pro-120 hard, one of two things happens:

Has the system just been setup or is it a system that worked properly once, and has failed?


Other pages relevant to this


Page Information


© 2001-2008 4QD
Page's Author: Richard Torrens
First published: 13th June, 2001.
Document URI: www.4qd.co.uk /serv/profaults.html
Last modified: Friday, 02-May-2008 10:39:58 BST